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 Post subject: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:53 pm 
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I didn't realize how bad the Michigan job market was until I actually had to hire someone. Not only is it bad for the workers, but it royally sucks for the employers. I spent the better part of two weeks just weeding through the 40 or so resumes I received from my monster posting. Over half of them were WAY over qualified. Of those, a good portion of them were not even US Citizens. They were here working on Visas that we would have had to pay for. 6 resumes I had were qualified individuals. The rest were people that were "good with computers" that were currently working at McDonalds and Taco Bell. Of those 6 qualified, one was from out of state. The other were all from Michigan and in this general area, athough 1 was over 3 hours away. Anyway, out of those 6, only 4 of them actually bothered to return my phone calls... The first guy was ok, but he wanted a little too much money for what the position entailed (entry-level no experiance required software developer). The second guy really had my interest, but he showed up a half hour early and then asked a ton of questions about benefits, tution reimbursement (because he wanted his PHD!!!), and misc other stuff that ended up making the interview about an hour long. He should have held a lot of those questions until we actually made an offer. The 3rd person was a VERY nice and VERY personable woman. She was Indian and we actually had a great conversation, but half way through the interview, she told me that programming was not her strong suit! Ugh. That's the main skill for the job. At least she was honest... So it was back to way early guy... Then I get the phone call from the guy from out of state. I liked everything about this guy, including the skills he showed with only having about 3 weeks of real professional experiance... So we hired him. He's coming from Louisianna.

I just cannot believe that the Michigan job market sucks for employers so much. I thought for sure that we would be able to pick from some of the best up and coming people since jobs were so scarce... I guess they all moved.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 8:50 am 
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Ha.ha.ha..... you should talk to my wife! She started a new position as a director of shared services in Farmington Hills June 23rd. Long story short the employees had the attitude "I'm not doing that" or "not the way we did it before" etc..
She had one young lady that had missed 32 consecutive Mondays. After a talk with the girl basically: miss again and you will be terminated the girl was absent the following Monday. My wife dismissed her..the young lady's response. "I can't give up my weekends; I have a life outside of work you know." Today three contract workers will be terminated for failure to follow directives. My wife was hired to completely revamp / reconstruct the department and the workers don't like the direction the company is taking so they refuse to do the new processes. I thought the way the job market is here in Michigan a person would do the necessary effort to maintain employment. She called the company's usual contract house to notify them that they were now competing with two other companies for placement of employees and that she is enlarging her department from 12 to 45 workers during the next 18 months and expects ONLY qualified applicants. After 12 months workers may be considered for permanant hire with the company.

I don't understand the stuff but she is taking a private company public and combining all the financial and accounting practices, accounts receivable and payable etc into one location and one department.

Anyway after that long response let me say: yeah it's amazing that people don't give a rat's behind about looking for or keeping their positions. Boggles the mind!

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:09 am 
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That's hilarious. "I'm not giving up my weekends."

Every candidate that I interviewed that I liked were less focused on themselves and what are we going to give them and more focused on doing the job, but they still had that hint of "if I'm not making top dollar within a year, I'm outta here" ... Made me really uncomfortable when hiring someone. Being a small company, we can't afford to pay top dollar. We usually only hire people that are on fire for doing the job yet don't really NEED to make top dollar to be happy. Not finding many of those around here.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:34 am 
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Well, I look at the problem as a unique social issue. Our entire economy for the last 100 years has been based soley around the automotive industry. Our educational institutions geared for life in the auto industry. If one did not go onto university they went to a exceptional high, top dollar position in manufacturing. Big pay, no higher education, union jobs. We became accustomed to our toys: boats, snowmobiles, atv etc.. Have you ever met an automotive line worker tht didn't have a cottage up north? Now the unions have lost power and even the production line positions require an education be it in robotics or simple computer literacy. Our well paid, under educated workforce never adapted for the future even when the writing was on the wall. I have a neighbor who accepted the $140,000 payout package from Ford Motor Company last year. Her plan was to use the money to retrain and pursue a new career. She never attended training and squandered the money on exotic trips..African Safari and The Virgin Islands, she felt deserving ofthe trips because she worked hard in the past. Her house was foreclosed last week.

As for not having the trained personel...we have no mass transit and the social network for the younger people is nearly non-existent outside of Ann Arbor and Royal Oak. Not very conducive to retaining the top notch candidates. So we are experiencing "brain drain". The are fleeing the state.

In closing!!!! :lol: :lol: It sounds like you were hit with the mass resume mailings of people. The send out as many resumes as possible regardless of qualifications and hope something hits.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:45 pm 
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The job market in Calgary has been kind of the opposite of Michigan's for awhile. Fast food joints have had to alter their hours because they can't hire enough staff. Restaurants are short on waitresses, retail is understaffed - basically all the low-wage jobs can't be filled because there's a glut of higher paying jobs. For example, there are tons of really high paying construction jobs (for example I met a guy with a 9-month certificate in working sheet metal who is making $42 / hour doing ventilation work on a huge construction site). Even skill-less construction has to pay pretty well. The flip side is that living costs are ridiculously high as a consequence, so if you're a retail worker, PhD student, or other unskilled wage-slave, you can barely afford rent (my "super prestigious" scholarship that allowed me to buy fancy camera gear by paying me as much as an unskilled construction labourer has run out, and my remaining "only prestigious" scholarship which is a typical PhD salary is less than a full time gas station employee would earn).

An employer I know from a software / network security company once went to a job fair at the University of Calgary, and one kid came up to him, puffed up his chest, and asked "SO: What are you going to offer me?" His response was "Absolutely nothing. Get lost." This was around the time some-big-oil-company was offering a $100,000 incentive bonus to new employees fresh out of a basic business degree at the university to go fly up to Fort McMurray and work on the oil sands or something.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:46 pm 
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Michigan gal here. I was dumbfounded when everyone I know said the auto industry issues won't hurt the medical field. These are now the same people that no longer have insurance and can't afford to see a Doctor.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 12:48 am 
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Wow this is an old thread.

On the subject, anybody want to hire me for anything? ;)

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Last edited by walter23 on Sun Apr 17, 2011 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 8:36 am 
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Wow, a blast from the past! :) This thread is so outdated I can update that my wife successfully consolidated 14 independent accounting methods and locations into a shared services, one method, one location in Michigan. Two weeks after the successful integration the company ascertained the department was now streamlined enough to send overseas to India. Since September 2009 the department has been located Hajderbad India. The pisser was she could run the department here for nearly $600K less than sending it offshore but the company is offsetting the savings by paying substantially less in US taxes. Unfortunately that is the main hazard of her job, streamline,consolodate and making it easier to send a department offshore.


Toonsies wrote:
Michigan gal here. I was dumbfounded when everyone I know said the auto industry issues won't hurt the medical field. These are now the same people that no longer have insurance and can't afford to see a Doctor.


Never underestimate the power of the trickle down effect of the auto industry. People tend not to remember history and the examples of 1974 and 1979 would have cleared the cobwebs. 1979 brought in the $400 million bailout of Chrysler and many of the steel mills never recovered. My father-in-law's grocery stores were shoplifted out of business the economics were very similar to today.

Where do you call home in MI. ?

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 11:45 am 
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Three years makes a big difference, the markets for jobs must be much tighter in MI and favor the employers, unemployment in our area is over %9 and growing. My son looking for and entry level job for the past year has found nothing. He does have a learning disability but he should still be able to find something in a normal job market. My job could be sent off shore any time this year our company is looking at options right now we expect to hear the bad news within weeks. Knowing that the few companies that still have data centers in our area don't have many openings makes me nervous. I have never wanted to turn my hobby into a job but I am seriously thinking about how I can do that.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 11:44 am 
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It's funny this topic came up again. We are hiring a tech support position. The difference a few years makes... Last time we posted we had over 600 resumes come in. Only about 20 of them really apply to the position we posted, the rest were just people looking for anything they could get. This time, I think we got about 200 in, and about 75 of them were appropriate. I think most people that were looking for work have just moved. The job market here is still crap. We are only hiring because we absolutely have to in order to get our customer satisfaction levels back up. Unfortunately this hire will probably result in one being fired.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:05 pm 
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So, as a job seeker, I have a question for you employee seekers; how do you wade through all those resumés? I suspect the job market where I live is similar with people bombing their resumés out to positions they aren't qualified for, and I also suspect there are a lot of qualified applicants for every job. What features make you pull a resume out of the huge pile for further scrutiny, besides being not an obvious resumé bombing resumé? Does it come down to luck of the draw?

I know the generic answers and I know how to address them (be succinct, show you are qualified for the job by addressing points in the posting, etc), but what else catches your eye?

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 6:12 pm 
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I can tell you what my wife looked for: not so much info about the person but more of what the person has accomplished. " I am a self-motivator" sent the resume to file 13. She looked for the introductory resume with a nice cover letter not the "novel."

Here's an example of what she has put out into the world. She has had about six interviews around the globe but looks like she'll be ending up employed back in good ole Detroit.

http://dianelangford.resumeconnect.com/

Hope this is the info you are looking for. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:44 pm 
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walter23 wrote:
So, as a job seeker, I have a question for you employee seekers; how do you wade through all those resumés? I suspect the job market where I live is similar with people bombing their resumés out to positions they aren't qualified for, and I also suspect there are a lot of qualified applicants for every job. What features make you pull a resume out of the huge pile for further scrutiny, besides being not an obvious resumé bombing resumé? Does it come down to luck of the draw?

I know the generic answers and I know how to address them (be succinct, show you are qualified for the job by addressing points in the posting, etc), but what else catches your eye?


For me it's not luck of the draw. The first thing I look for is a skills based resume. If all you are doing is listing previous employment and what you did there, I'm not interested. I don't want to call every candidate and ask them specifics about what technologies they are using. I was to see that right up top. And not B.S. skills either, like "Self motivator". If you list self motivator, I throw it out. The next thing I look for is relevant experience. If you have 5 jobs listed and only 2 apply, then to me it seems you spent more time not doing what I want you to be doing, unless it's entry level. If it's entry level, I give credit for misc. jobs that were held trying to break into doing what you really want to be doing...

Also, the cover letter is highly important. If it had a cover letter, it almost always went to the yes pile unless the resume was a flaming pile of poo. Cover letters show that you know how to do written communication. It also shows that you aren't just bulk mailing your resume to 50 companies a day waiting for the one to stick. It needs to be personalized and it needs to reflect something in the posting, the company, and why you would fit in.

I was looking for a job in Tennessee last year. I sent out 20 resumes and never got a call. I changed my resume to a skills based one, typed up a cover letter to send with it, and then sent it out another 20 times. I had 5 interviews (in person) set up in less than a week, and also 8 phone interviews after that. It does work well and it sets you apart. Most people get lazy when looking for a job and it shows in your resume and lack of cover letter, so make sure you include it.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 9:41 am 
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All I'm going to say is that I have been away from the I/T arena for 11+ years. I have worked a variety of odd jobs and none in the field I was working in. I just finished and earned an Associate of Science - Information Technology, Cisco Network Professional from the local community college and still no takers on getting real work. So, I am in agreement that the Michigan Job Market is not were it is supposed to be.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:06 am 
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There are a lot of employers responding to the threads like these. This from the other side. I am a holder of a CDL with all the endorsements, a clean MVR, and quite a few years exp.

When I was hired on there was a lot of misleading that got me to sign on, the state of the equipment, the company's CSA record, and the number of hours required to work, and the number of hrs that will actually get paid (there are weeks that I only get paid 50 out of 70 hrs worked). We all work 70hrs in 5 days in a mix of long driving and dock work on open air docks (OH, MI get damn cold in the winter). Get around 5 hrs sleep. The drivers are getting VERY fatigued and that is a dangerous thing. This was brought up at a weekly meeting, and what was managements response? "this is a non union shop, and we can do what ever we want, don't like it? leave." (also the trucking industry is exempt from the fair labor laws) The turnover average in the industry is 105%, theirs is much higher, and I will soon be one of them. If this is how management acts in an industry where under the best of conditions it is hard to get good drivers, I wonder how it is for those poor people where there are no other jobs to go to. There are a lot of laws being broken by employers abusing people because they know they are terrified of being out of work and having no place else to go….It seems that the feudal system is back.

Just a thought, and certainly not meant as a slap at anyone on this board.

EDIT- also management has been telling the less experienced drivers that dock work is not counted against the 70 hr rule in an effort to get them to work more than 70 a week. This is a flat out lie, any paid work in 8 days counts against the 70 hr rule, even if it is at McDonalds on the weekend. One driver when they tried to scare him in to this told them to go pound salt *snicker* Bless his heart.

And there are a bunch of people out there that think that driving a big truck is a cake walk…..sigh…….

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:35 am 
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The job market is picking up,I don't now what jobs but the past three years it's been a quick 25 minute ride to work and now it's 35 minutes because of traffic. It's not back to the longtime 40 minute ride with a back up at the Little Mack exit but people are heading downtown at 6:30AM again.
We'll be putting in an advertisement for 2 college workers this spring and I know we'll get piled with applications.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:44 am 
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eastsider wrote:
The job market is picking up,I don't now what jobs but the past three years it's been a quick 25 minute ride to work and now it's 35 minutes because of traffic. It's not back to the longtime 40 minute ride with a back up at the Little Mack exit but people are heading downtown at 6:30AM again.
We'll be putting in an advertisement for 2 college workers this spring and I know we'll get piled with applications.


That is good news :) MI is in desperate straits. The area (south side of Detroit) where one of our co's terms is is like a third world country, there are houses that have collapsed into the street, and all that was done is to push it back to the side walk.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:23 am 
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Thunder wrote:
eastsider wrote:
The job market is picking up,I don't now what jobs but the past three years it's been a quick 25 minute ride to work and now it's 35 minutes because of traffic. It's not back to the longtime 40 minute ride with a back up at the Little Mack exit but people are heading downtown at 6:30AM again.
We'll be putting in an advertisement for 2 college workers this spring and I know we'll get piled with applications.


That is good news :) MI is in desperate straits. The area (south side of Detroit) where one of our co's terms is is like a third world country, there are houses that have collapsed into the street, and all that was done is to push it back to the side walk.


At it's peak Detroit was 2 million people strong but today it is under 750,000, the plan is to shrink the borders of the city and reclaim many areas to parks, forest and agriculture. It takes money and time. If a house is rubble there is an arduous legal procedure to endure to even remove the debris. Remove it without legal protection and an owner will appear and claimed the city has illegally seized his property. Compile that to the new law that was voted in several years ago that the owner illegally confiscated or public domain property will receive 133% of the property's stated value.
If Detroit could remove 10 useless homes/building per day it would take 20 years to clear the land. We are talking 10's of thousands of abandoned properties.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2012 1:25 pm 
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eastsider wrote:
Thunder wrote:
eastsider wrote:
The job market is picking up,I don't now what jobs but the past three years it's been a quick 25 minute ride to work and now it's 35 minutes because of traffic. It's not back to the longtime 40 minute ride with a back up at the Little Mack exit but people are heading downtown at 6:30AM again.
We'll be putting in an advertisement for 2 college workers this spring and I know we'll get piled with applications.


That is good news :) MI is in desperate straits. The area (south side of Detroit) where one of our co's terms is is like a third world country, there are houses that have collapsed into the street, and all that was done is to push it back to the side walk.


At it's peak Detroit was 2 million people strong but today it is under 750,000, the plan is to shrink the borders of the city and reclaim many areas to parks, forest and agriculture. It takes money and time. If a house is rubble there is an arduous legal procedure to endure to even remove the debris. Remove it without legal protection and an owner will appear and claimed the city has illegally seized his property. Compile that to the new law that was voted in several years ago that the owner illegally confiscated or public domain property will receive 133% of the property's stated value.
If Detroit could remove 10 useless homes/building per day it would take 20 years to clear the land. We are talking 10's of thousands of abandoned properties.



It is a shame, sounds like the gov. tripping over its self and the people end up as the loosers. There was a pile of junk that was removed from a house and it sat on the tree lawn for 4 months before it was removed. Very sad :( an absurd state for an American power house, I really hope that it turns around for MI.

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 11:55 am 
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We had to hire yet again this last month. This time for a software development position. We tried Monster, Career Builder, and Dice. We got 15 resumes. 5 were out of state looking for remote positions (which we don't do). The remaining 10 were called (as they fit the skills profile), 5 responded by setting up interviews, and only 1 showed up for the actual interview. Needless to say, I took a chance and hired the one guy that showed up, so he got the job by default.

I talked to a recruiting firm just to see what they charge and to discuss the current landscape for software jobs in Michigan. It seems that the position we were hiring for had only a 3% unemployment rate, in which that 3% are mostly people that don't want to work at this point in time. So we are trying to hire people away from already stable jobs, which is very hard for us to do competitively. It seems Detroit is just BOOMING for tech jobs right now.

I'm still poor, though. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Michigan Job Market
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:07 pm 
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Aaron wrote:
It seems Detroit is just BOOMING for tech jobs right now.



Yeah...got anything for a kid with a degree in Biology, History and Film Studies, 'cause I can't get him out of our basement!:lol:

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