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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:11 pm 
Show & Tell . . .
I found this Falling Plate Camera on ebay and just had to have it. Known as a Western Magazine No.2 and/or a Cyclone No. 2. It was originally made by the Western Camera Mfg. Co. in 1899. The company only lasted one year. They merged with four other companies to become the Rochester Optical and Camera Company. They only lasted 3-4 years 1899-1903, and my camera here was made during that short period. Kodak then bought them all out in 1903 for $330,000 and they put an end to this camera line. :(

The functions are fairly uncomplicated, being one shutter speed and several iris size settings, similar to Waterhouse stops. The plate holder size for this version (the No. 2) is 3.25 x 4.25. With a simple modification to the plate holders, they now hold film instead of glass plates. The camera is quite large, 5"W x 7.75"L x 6"H and has 12 steel plate holders inside. What I really like about this unit is you can take one or two exposures, remove just those plates, and then develop them. The last photo shown below is an early test shot made on Efke ISO 100 film made shortly after receiving the camera. Just a negative scan, inverted and adjusted. Not shown in this scan is the vignetting in the corners of the film cause by the simple camera design.

A link Original Advertisement showing innards, etc. . .
http://books.google.com/books?id=D4A1AA ... tQP33_HoDw
http://books.google.com/books?id=9w4wAA ... sQPLjpjCDw

Image

Image


Last edited by X. Phot. on Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:16 pm 
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Wowowowowowowow ... that is so cool. So where do you get accessories and parts?

Gary

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:42 pm 
Seefutlung wrote:
Wowowowowowowow ... that is so cool. So where do you get accessories and parts?

Gary


It has everything already. What else could you possibly want on a camera? :lol:


Last edited by X. Phot. on Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:50 pm 
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DannL wrote:
Seefutlung wrote:
Wowowowowowowow ... that is so cool. So where do you get accessories and parts?

Gary


It has everything already. What else could you possibly want on a camera? :lol:


a motor drive maybe ... 8 track tape player ... lol

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:53 pm 
There is one feature on this camera that is amiss. The plate counter is broken. But, a piece of wire and a bit of solder should fix it. Seriously. There is a plate counter under that big silver turn key on the side.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:14 pm 
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DannL wrote:
There is one feature on this camera that is amiss. The plate counter is broken. But, a piece of wire and a bit of solder should fix it. Seriously. There is a plate counter under that big silver turn key on the side.


I think that is funny ... (your post has caused me to poke around ebay...)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:31 pm 
Seefutlung wrote:
DannL wrote:
There is one feature on this camera that is amiss. The plate counter is broken. But, a piece of wire and a bit of solder should fix it. Seriously. There is a plate counter under that big silver turn key on the side.


I think that is funny ... (your post has caused me to poke around ebay...)


Every week approximately 10,000 film cameras, LF, MF and others are available on eBay. And next week another 10,000 ads will be posted. Many of these are antiques. And those are the ones that I seek. If you're really patient you can have the camera of your dreams. This camera set me back 16 bucks. What got me really interested was that the owner mentioned that they couldn't figure how to open the camera. That meant to me that there was a possibility there were glass plates inside. When I received the camera, there were five undeveloped plates still in the camera. After I developed them, they were found to be just solid black (fogged) with no images. :(


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:33 pm 
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You continue to amaze me by resurrecting these old cameras that I had always dismissed as lost causes / hopelessly obsolete. I'm actually also quite surprised by the quality of the negative - I had assumed these would have sort of a simple meniscus lens with severe Holga-style aberrations.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:38 pm 
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DannL wrote:
Seefutlung wrote:
DannL wrote:
There is one feature on this camera that is amiss. The plate counter is broken. But, a piece of wire and a bit of solder should fix it. Seriously. There is a plate counter under that big silver turn key on the side.


I think that is funny ... (your post has caused me to poke around ebay...)


Every week approximately 10,000 film cameras, LF, MF and others are available on eBay. And next week another 10,000 ads will be posted. Many of these are antiques. And those are the ones that I seek. If you're really patient you can have the camera of your dreams. This camera set me back 16 bucks. What got me really interested was that the owner mentioned that they couldn't figure how to open the camera. That meant to me that there was a possibility there were glass plates inside. When I received the camera, there were five undeveloped plates still in the camera. After I developed them, they were found to be just solid black (fogged) with no images. :(


Damn ... probably heat.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:59 pm 
walter23 wrote:
You continue to amaze me by resurrecting these old cameras that I had always dismissed as lost causes / hopelessly obsolete. I'm actually also quite surprised by the quality of the negative - I had assumed these would have sort of a simple meniscus lens with severe Holga-style aberrations.


I'm sure I read somewhere that it was a single cemented doublet of the anastigmat design. I'll research that again.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:44 pm 
Seefutlung wrote:
Damn ... probably heat.


It could be that, or possibly oxidation over the years. The camera originated for Lebanon NJ. I'm sure the camera has see plenty of varying climate conditions. But there's no rust on the camera to speak of. A little bit on a couple of the steel plates and a touch on the lens cover (seen in photo).


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 1:24 am 
Well, the advertisements which I have found, the few, state that the 1899 model Cyclone is "fitted with a corrected Achromatic lens ". It doesn't tell me if it's an Achromatic Doublet or a Meniscus Achromatic lens. In either case it's seems to be the the only lens currently available from the manufacturer. I'll have to live with it.

http://books.google.com/books?id=BCkWAA ... WSMvraiJ0I
http://books.google.com/books?id=xTNYAA ... aoM42sqZYK

I did find a good book, though. It covers the Cyclone, plus others to include the Adlake Repeater camera . . . my next big purchase.
Modern Photography in Theory and Practice
http://books.google.com/books?id=o1OaAA ... ysMoam7dcJ

Here are some Magazine Camera basics . . .
http://www.camerapedia.org/wiki/Magazine_camera


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:46 pm 
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What an awesome find! I would have been intrigued about the possibility of glass plates too. I'm fascinated by glass negatives myself and have a (very) small collection of them, complete with the wood frames. The hard part is finding plates that aren't of people, since most photos were taken of family members in those days, and not landscapes or architecture. (Not that I mind the people, but I find the old architecture plates most interesting.)

My family has an old camera on display, I'll have too see what it is.

Only $16? That's just 3 times it's original market value! :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 2:14 pm 
EyesLifted wrote:
What an awesome find! I would have been intrigued about the possibility of glass plates too. I'm fascinated by glass negatives myself and have a (very) small collection of them, complete with the wood frames. The hard part is finding plates that aren't of people, since most photos were taken of family members in those days, and not landscapes or architecture. (Not that I mind the people, but I find the old architecture plates most interesting.)

My family has an old camera on display, I'll have too see what it is.

Only $16? That's just 3 times it's original market value! :lol:


Wow! Sounds like you've been at this for a while. You are correct. People are found in most photographs, and even today. I don't mind people-photos if the photograph is special in some way. As in, the person is famous, or being engaged in something funny or significant. Tintypes are quite interesting. I enjoy old photographs that depict people engaged in their employment. This past week I purchased "what I consider to be" an incredible negative from a eBay seller. Haven't received it yet, but I'm very anxious. I bought it specifically to practice printing from a negative that has possibilities, vs printing from negatives of my own (which generally stink).

http://stores.ebay.com/Judahpraise-Vint ... -Negatives


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:31 am 
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One of these is listed on ebay at the moment but I'm too financially strained to even place the $30 starting bid.

Another day... once this degree is finished and I have a job and can afford $30 items again :)

I also have to clean the slow shutter on my Avus 9x12, buy 9x12 film, and get my Zeiss Super Ikonta fixed up (lens needs a clean and since moving to the new humid climate the focusing helical has seized up).

And then there's that matter of the 8x10 bellows... and the bromoil project.. and the gum printing project.

Time and money, man.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 2:06 pm 
I have eyeballed that camera and decided against it. That 4x5 Cyclone camera is missing a peice/part. You'll notice on the side of the camera there is a place where the shutter release is located. There should be a tapered brass stem there. Alas, it's missing. The Cyclone 4x5 model was fired by a rubber hose and bulb release. There was a complete 4x5 Cyclone which sold on eBay for $19.00 only a week ago. I thought that to be a fair price.

The bulb can be seen here . . .
http://www.google.com/books?id=D4A1AAAA ... mIM4zB4IQN
http://www.google.com/books?id=o1OaAAAA ... mIM4zB4IQN

I found this ad here (3/4 way down, middle column) for a good 4x5 Cyclone for only $1.50 . . . I might write the guy. He lives in Jersey.
http://www.google.com/books?id=jrkaAAAA ... mIM4zB4IQN


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:12 am 
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I can't see any of those images. I even went through a rigamarole of using a US proxy, just in case google books was applying different copyright standards to Canadians, but I only get "torn page" previews of strips of those magazine ads or whatever they are.

I just bid on a magazine camera, because I'm a sucker for novelty old cameras. I'll probably regret it. Looking more carefully the plate holders look bent, the viewing lenses filthy (maybe they can be cleaned), and the inside looks filthy. Also it might be missing the nipple for the rubber bulb hose. Hopefully someone else will bid on it and I'll lose it. It's $20 right now.

If I win, I guess I'll have yet another restoration project to fondle ;)

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 9:55 pm 
walter23 wrote:
I can't see any of those images. I even went through a rigamarole of using a US proxy, just in case google books was applying different copyright standards to Canadians, but I only get "torn page" previews of strips of those magazine ads or whatever they are.


That sounds strange. Just curious . . .

If you go to http://books.google.com/ and type "cyclone camera" on the search line, and search for that, it should return a gob of book entries. If you then select "Full View Only" from the Showing: pulldown menu you should then get all the "full view" books. In this case for example the third book in the current list is "McClure's Magazine" . . . and if you click on that book title do you still get the torn page message?


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 3:22 am 
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Nope Dann, doesn't work for me. For full view, "cyclone camera", I only get 7 totally spurious hits.

Must be a regional thing.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:06 am 
walter23 wrote:
Nope Dann, doesn't work for me. For full view, "cyclone camera", I only get 7 totally spurious hits.

Must be a regional thing.


Those "Google Bastards"! I wonder if they are using Chinese Internet Filtering Technology? (CIFT). Get it? A pseudo-pun on the word "sift". :D

Here you go . . . Pages 8/9/10 in this PDF (labeled as Page 36/37/38) . . . http://www.cameramanuals.org/booklets/p ... _31-61.pdf

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/booklet/ph ... z_list.htm


Here's a similar version on ebay, but it looks like the stem is bent. (I don't think it's a Cyclone either). As usual $45 starting price seems perty steep to me. Making sure all the plate holders are with the camera is also very important.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Large-BOX-Camera-c- ... dZViewItem


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 11:56 am 
walter23 wrote:
. . .

I just bid on a magazine camera, because I'm a sucker for novelty old cameras. I'll probably regret it. Looking more carefully the plate holders look bent, the viewing lenses filthy (maybe they can be cleaned), and the inside looks filthy. Also it might be missing the nipple for the rubber bulb hose. Hopefully someone else will bid on it and I'll lose it. It's $20 right now.

If I win, I guess I'll have yet another restoration project to fondle ;)


Only 23 hours 6 mins . . . . :shock:

It'll be almost as fun as watching this . . .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9k-AXlMyME


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:24 pm 
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DannL wrote:
walter23 wrote:
. . .

I just bid on a magazine camera, because I'm a sucker for novelty old cameras. I'll probably regret it. Looking more carefully the plate holders look bent, the viewing lenses filthy (maybe they can be cleaned), and the inside looks filthy. Also it might be missing the nipple for the rubber bulb hose. Hopefully someone else will bid on it and I'll lose it. It's $20 right now.

If I win, I guess I'll have yet another restoration project to fondle ;)


Only 23 hours 6 mins . . . . :shock:


There's a much nicer version of the same camera up there as well, but at $45 I'm not bidding unless the piece of audio equipment I listed for sale sells with the buy it now ($85) before the camera ends.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:33 pm 
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DannL wrote:
advertising materials


Finally got around to browsing through these. Fantastic! Thanks a lot! Not exactly what I need though; a collector's manifesto if I ever saw one.

Plus a ton of little gems, like the Kodak film & dry plate processing service ad from 1888 ("When You Come Back From your summer vacation, you can bring nothing with you that will afford greater satisfaction to your friends or yourself than 100 or more Photographs, taken with the KODAK Camera and forming a picturesque note-book of your travels. You press the button, we do the rest.").



DannL wrote:
Here's a similar version on ebay, but it looks like the stem is bent. (I don't think it's a Cyclone either). As usual $45 starting price seems perty steep to me. Making sure all the plate holders are with the camera is also very important.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Large-BOX-Camera-c- ... dZViewItem


Yeah, I've been watching that one.. it's the one I mentioned above. If it were $20, or if my hi-fi equipment sells in the next couple of hours, I'll bid last minute on it. But $45 is too pricey for an impulse purchase like this without selling something else to fund it.

The one I'm bidding on now looks like the same model, but it may be missing the bulb nipple and the plate holders look bent or something. Plus it's pretty dirty (can probably be cleaned up though).

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 12:22 am 
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Guy built a modern pinhole one a couple of years ago. Cool!

http://www.f295.org/Pinholeforum/forum/ ... /s-0/#num5

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 12:54 am 
walter23 wrote:
Guy built a modern pinhole one a couple of years ago. Cool!

http://www.f295.org/Pinholeforum/forum/ ... /s-0/#num5


Berry, berry, interesting.

Another solution instead of working in metal might be to fiberglass resin a cardboard box and then cover it in moroccan leather.


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